motor setup

[keegster17]

i am setting up a motor, but very awkward setup. i have 18" dish on "j" pole extension with a motor (hh90), pole goes around eaves of the house and up over above roof. I really don't have access to move dish. lol. so any adjustments i must untighten bolts on pole and lower unit. confusing but my question is i am aiming for 82w and hitting it plus hitting 91. signal is not bad but needs to be tweaked. problem is... i am missing 110 and 119. so do you think the dish is pointing to high or to low. i need some idea as setup is a very big pain making adjustments. i have a feeling i am a aiming a bit high?

[Terryl]

Well it's very tough to setup a motor to just get the 4 providers satellites.

Most of the time you set it up to follow the Clark belt, this is done by first setting it to zero facing DUE South, then finding the closest satellite to due South from your location. (mine just happens to be 121W as my Longitude is 121)

If the motor is not following the true arc of the belt then you can be too high or too low when you pan East or West.

You might have to first find you Longitude then look on lyngsat and find the satellite closest to due South from your location, this maybe a linear satellite so you may need to change the LNB, I used a Invacom LNB to setup my motor, this type will pick up the circular birds (Dish and BEV) and the linear birds.

[Costactc]

Providers sats are always powerful and come in strong so you shouldn't have too many issues finding them, you'll probably have to make a few adjustments to maximise signal quality as they will break up during bad weather if the dish isn't aligned properly.

[Terryl]

You also must remeber that the motor does all the skewing for the dish and attached LNB, so the dish it's self must not be skewd, it all should be set to "0" or "90" degrees for the skew, if the 18" dish is a D500 pan you must check to see that it's at zero skew.

You also should be using a single LNB, if you still have the "Y" yoke on it for 2 LNB's it can throw your settings off, the LNB should be dead center of the dish.

It has been done with the DP twin or two DP singles, but the aiming is quite a bit different, you can't use USALS to find the birds as that is for a single LNB, the twin mount has the LNB's 4.5 degrees off center, so if you use USALS you can miss the birds by that much.

But the critical things are to be sure the dish and motor are zeroed at DUE South first, and the correct Azimuth (direction) and Elevation settings* for your DUE South satellite are correct.

*Elevation settings for some motors are 1/2 set with the motor, 1/2 set with the dish, check your mounting instructions for the motor.

[keegster17]

i am using a 18" dish single lnb. i had this setup at home and worked well. i picked up 129, 110, 119, 82 and 91. right now i am having issues with the dish pole and the depth of the eaves. the pole is not a 100 percent plump because the eave comes out far. i am picking up 91 and 82 and making 82 my due south dish, always did it this way with success. but i am missing 110 and 119. I think my issue is the elevation. I just remembered i can adjust the elevation on the dish. i have been messing with the motor long. and lat. but nothing. this is a new location from were my old set up was, about half hour drive difference. i will try changing dish elevation and hopefully the pole will not be a problem.

[Terryl]

Well the pole being out of plumb may very well be the problem, if it's out of alignment front to back, left to right or diagonally, it will throw your tracking of the Clark belt off by how far it's out of plumb, if it's leanig forward and you can't adjust the mast, then you could try spacer's under the bottom of the motor mount, you would have to remove the motor from it's mount and adjust it using a level (or the plumb bob), adding spacers (don't use wood) to get it plumb.

The old way (and the best way) is to use a plumb bob, attach it to the top of the mast and let it hang down, adjust the mount to align it with the string, this gets the mount as level as you can.

Also be sure the mast is not kicked out of alignment by the attachment point at the eave.

[Terryl]

If looking at it from the front and it's off left or right you can use stays to pull it to the left or right, these are pieces of threaded rod and a long turn turn buckle, attached with a 1 1/2" conduit hanger.

Or look for an old WildBlue/Hugesnet or Starband internet dish and take the braces off it.

You can use some of these.

http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=es148546&d=wildblue-adjustable-tri-mast-stay-%28es148546%29

[keegster17]

facing dish from the back, and the back of the pole. the pole is level (left/right) basically i have to move the pole out and forward to get plump that way. perhaps I can adjust elevation on dish to make this up?

[Terryl]

No....The mast has to be level or the motors mount has to be level or it will be off.

The motor and dish must face due south, the dish elevation adjustment may not correct for a mast that is not plumb by leaning back against the house, not unless the house is facing due south and that front to back adjustment is correcting the due South adjustment.

If the mast is absolutely level then the motor will not have any problems following the arc of the Clark belt, remember your trying to hit something the size of an SUV at 22,500 miles away, if your off by more then 1.5 degrees of arc you will miss the satellite.

You said you moved, and are still using 82W as your due south bird, this may have changed, take a look on Google Earth and see what Longitude you at now, then look at Lyngsat.com and see if your still able to use 82W.

[keegster17]

i will post a pic in the morning so you can see what i have done.

[keegster17]

201842018520186

[keegster17]

i actually climb out a bedroom window and stand on garage roof to set this thing up. lol. I may build a bracket to build the dish away from the house wall and eaves so the pole can go straight up and not on a angle.

[Glatt]

Terryl is right in perfect alignment! Just use a longer extension to clear your eaves!

[keegster17]

it's going to be one heck of a hardware setup. lol. already have a 39" pole with a additional piece of piping about 2 feet. thanks guys.

[Terryl]

WOW!! Looking at that, it's going to be tough to get it straight.

You may need to drop it down a bit on the wall and then go a bit longer on the "J" pole, this to get the bend to clear the eave, also is the dish pointing back onto the roof? Or is it clearing as it pans left to right?

[keegster17]

even if I go lower it won't clear, I have made a bracket out of metal to build it out from the wall for more clearance. going to try this weekend. fun stuff, it is horrible setup because every adjustment requires swinging the pole down and adjusting dish while standing on a very slope roof below. lol. I will get there.

[keegster17]

guys I built out the unit from the wall to clear the eaves. Used a piece of square bar metal. So my pole is level, and I am hitting 82 and 91 with solid signal and quality, but still missing 110 and 119. I know the dish moves quit different on a motor, do you think maybe my elevation is either to high or to low if I am missing 110 and 119? to me it sounds like my elavation is slightly to high? any thoughts?

[Terryl]

Did you do the Due South on the dish and motor as a zero, and find the Due South bird?

IF not then you still could be missing the end satellites.

Now on the dish and motor elevation, did you go by the motor's elevation guide in the manual?

Some (if not all) motors need the elevations split between some part set on the dish and the rest set on the motor, if this is off then your going to mis-track on the arc.

[keegster17]

yeah I have been messing with these motors for a few years. I was just wondering what someone might think in terms of elevation on the dish if I am hitting 82 and 91 but missing 110 & 119 is my dish elevation possibly to high or low? the motor is set correct at approx 44.0 see below.

Dish Setup Data
Latitude: 43.XXXX°
Longitude: -79.XXXX°
Name: Stab HH90
Distance: 37819km
Motor Latitude: 43.8°
Declination Angle: 6.7°
Dish Elevation: 38°
Azimuth (true): 180.0°
Azimuth (magn.): 190.4°

[Terryl]

Well 44 degrees may be a bit too high and your missing the arc, you dont have any skew on that dish do you?

You should have zero skew on both the dish and LNB, try dropping the elevation on the motor 1 degree to 43, and make sure the skew is zero and the LNB is zeroed to the dish.

When pointing Due South the LNB should be absolutely vertical to the ground, and the dish should not be skewed in any direction, and double check the dishes elevation.

The motor if set right will do all the skewing.

And I edited your longitude and latitude to keep your house out of the picture.

[keegster17]

Thanks Terryl for the edit, didn't consider that. I will try with the motor to 43 not 44. No skew on dish, it has no skew as it is a 18". If the motor change does not work I will fiddle with the dish elevation. I got to be close. I am using a old Fortec Ultra just for the setup, then put the Jynxbox Ultra back in place.

[keegster17]

yeah I moved the dish a to my left, and now I found sat 72.7 i think, I got signal and quality in the 70's, but still no 110 and 119, does 110 and 119 sit higher on the belt or lower than 82 and 91?

[Terryl]

It all depends on where you live.

If your on the East coast side, then 110 and 119 would be lower in the sky, if your on the west coast side, then 82 and 91 would be lower in the sky, if your in the middle of the continent then they would be about equal.

Also too far North East or North West and they may be below the horizon, look on dishpointer.com and see where they are in relation to your location.


Now for other things.

Did you adjust the motor and dish to your "Due South" then the "Due South" Satellite first??

If not, then you will not track the arc of the Clark belt correctly, if pointing too far East you will miss the further West satellites, or if the elevation is too high or low you will not track right.

The motor and Dish/LNB must point exactly "Due South" first, then the elevation must be set to your exact "Latitude" this puts you on the arc, your "Due South" satellite is 82W, but do NOT use it to find the arc, it is 3 degrees off of your Due South, this would put you out of alignment for the Western satellites.

Also the motors mast must be as horizontally level as you can get it.

[keegster17]

So how will i find true south, if I have no reference point (satellite)? I use a compass or something? I never did it this way, but perhaps at this location I must. also how do i calculate dish elevation?

[Terryl]

Use a cell phone with a GPS app in it, or go to dishpointer.com, enter your address and select the due South option, this will give you a map with a line on it pointing to due South.

That site also has an option for motors.

Here is a link to a video that may help out.


http://sadoun.com/Sat/Installation/HH-mount-installation.htm

[alex.1604]

i have the same set up, and i get all the sats that use circular lnbs, with one lnb and a motor on a 18inch dish, before i was missing some sats but it was because my dish/motor were not align properly, they were off by a few degrees, so it could be that, make sure your dish is aligned properly otherwise you wont be able to see all sat.

[keegster17]

alex.1604 when you say aligned, do you mean elavation was off, or dish etc, was not level?