Dish Start Kicking sellers from Flebay!

[policemanpr]

Dick start to remove items for fta, satellite and other equipment that it use to may violate intellectual property rights .. Dick is a member of our Verified Rights Owner Program (VeRO), asking us to remove the item for this or that BEWARE! the last is a lettler to visit their office. :hand:

[dishuser]

they''ve been doing it for years

[niceguy]

if you factory reset the stb if you sell it on flebay they can pick up any info from the stb

[thunder bird]

Only if they buy the set top.

[fifties]

And then you can simply respond with, "it was that way when I bought it, off an eBay seller".

[kenkell1]

And then you can simply respond with, "it was that way when I bought it, off an eBay seller".

but the persons DNA is in each letter typed into the box lol......it's true ...I read it on the internet somewhere.

[fifties]

it's true ...I read it on the internet somewhere.
Well if it was posted on the internet somewhere...It must be true!

[sodusme]

The only thing I really see they can keep you from selling is maybe an 8PSK board since they (or someone else I can't remember) hold the patent rights to it.

If you wanted to sell a Jynxbox or Sonicview or whatever on there they can't do crap about it. The product itself is legal until which time its been 'modified' to receive illegal programming.

[dishuser]

The only thing I really see they can keep you from selling is maybe an 8PSK board since they (or someone else I can't remember) hold the patent rights to it.

If you wanted to sell a Jynxbox or Sonicview or whatever on there they can't do crap about it. The product itself is legal until which time its been 'modified' to receive illegal programming.so why are card sales deleted?lol

[sodusme]

so why are card sales deleted?lol

Well seeings how I don't have any D/N cards here to verify this I took a look at some DirecTV cards that I do have....and I noticed they say "This card is the property of DIRECTV and contains software distributed under limited license".

I would bet (and YES I am a gambling man ;) ) that your D/N cards will say the same thing.

So with all that said that is how Ebay can legally pull down postings selling cards.

[dishuser]

Well seeings how I don't have any D/N cards here to verify this I took a look at some DirecTV cards that I do have....and I noticed they say "This card is the property of DIRECTV and contains software distributed under limited license".

I would bet (and YES I am a gambling man ;) ) that your D/N cards will say the same thing.

So with all that said that is how Ebay can legally pull down postings selling cards.
shouldn't have sent it to me thinking it was yours
it's not a lease

[sodusme]

shouldn't have sent it to me thinking it was yours
it's not a lease

Oh I agree 110%....that is the same B.S. that 'ole Billy Gates has done with Windows. That is how he can screw up your desktop and basically lock you out of your own damn computer (that you have bought and paid for) after they have discovered that you are using 'pirated' software. Which shouldn't be allowed because you own the hardware outright....but Microsoft says basically you are 'leasing' the Windows version you are using. So he makes your computer that you bought and paid for and own outright....useless.

I would really like to know what 'software' that card in and of itself contains? What software resides on that card? I don't play with plastic so I can't answer that myself but I'm curious to know exactly resides on that card? Is it ROM or RAM or NVRAM? Is it a 'flash'....what exactly is it?

[fifties]

The only thing I really see they can keep you from selling is maybe an 8PSK board since they (or someone else I can't remember) hold the patent rights to it.

If you wanted to sell a Jynxbox or Sonicview or whatever on there they can't do crap about it. The product itself is legal until which time its been 'modified' to receive illegal programming.
DN has a contract with the maker of the 8PSK equipment, who hold the patents to that technology, which gives DN proprietary right in using it. That's why the FTA box makers couldn't legally include it from the factory. It had to be an "after market" add-on.
That said, I've seen, at least in the past, eBay sellers of FTA boxes which included the board, getting away with selling them.

AFA a 'modified' FTA box, of course all someone has to do is reload the factory bin, and it's almost as pure as the driven snow. I say, "almost", because there is S/W out there that can read what had been previously written on the boxes memory.


Well seeings how I don't have any D/N cards here to verify this I took a look at some DirecTV cards that I do have....and I noticed they say "This card is the property of DIRECTV and contains software distributed under limited license".

I would bet (and YES I am a gambling man ;) ) that your D/N cards will say the same thing.

So with all that said that is how Ebay can legally pull down postings selling cards.
Here's a scan of one of my ancient 010's, and yes, in case you can't read it, says the same thing;18174 Actually just click on it to enlarge.

The card's "computer" has what was called a "ROM" image of DN's encryption, which was what was copied for use in bins during the stand-alone dayz.

[thunder bird]

Who cares what it says.They ended up in the mail box never signed any thing Oops, wrong mail box:tehe:

[jvvh5897]

I would really like to know what 'software' that card in and of itself contains? What software resides on that card? I don't play with plastic so I can't answer that myself but I'm curious to know exactly resides on that card? Is it ROM or RAM or NVRAM? Is it a 'flash'....what exactly is it?

You can see what is in older datasheets for cards--there are a number on the web. There is some sort of processor core, often something like the old 8050 chip. Then there is RAM, Rom and EEPROM areas--it is interesting to look at the microphotographs for what is inside the cards and some of them are on the web too. Besides the processor there can be co-processors--like the ones used for fast decryption and for math.

[sodusme]

DN has a contract with the maker of the 8PSK equipment, who hold the patents to that technology, which gives DN proprietary right in using it. That's why the FTA box makers couldn't legally include it from the factory. It had to be an "after market" add-on.
That said, I've seen, at least in the past, eBay sellers of FTA boxes which included the board, getting away with selling them.

AFA a 'modified' FTA box, of course all someone has to do is reload the factory bin, and it's almost as pure as the driven snow. I say, "almost", because there is S/W out there that can read what had been previously written on the boxes memory.


Here's a scan of one of my ancient 010's, and yes, in case you can't read it, says the same thing;18174 Actually just click on it to enlarge.

The card's "computer" has what was called a "ROM" image of DN's encryption, which was what was copied for use in bins during the stand-alone dayz.

I'm thinking though you can rewrite that memory. I remember Viewsat I think it was had a 'cleaning' tool that would supposedly erase all evidence of third party software.

All you really have to do is 'format' it....its gonna be written in binary code 0's and 1's no matter what the software was that was loaded....write enough 0's and 1's to it and I can guarantee they ain't reading it ever again. ;)

[fifties]

I remember Viewsat I think it was had a 'cleaning' tool that would supposedly erase all evidence of third party software.
There was a situation back around 2008 or so when DN got some sort of court order allowing them to inspect Viewsat receivers that had been sent back to Viewtech for repair.

Of course most of the repair work needed was caused from ppl dorking their units by incorrectly loading S/W. So out came a "cleaner" file, that would allegedly scrub all evidence of a previously loaded "pirate" bin from the receiver, preventing DN from being able to finger scofflaws by using their "jaded" receiver as evidence.

Later on it was incorporated in a three-step bin loading process, to enable the receiver to avail itself in receiving IKS codes.

[sodusme]

There was a situation back around 2008 or so when DN got some sort of court order allowing them to inspect Viewsat receivers that had been sent back to Viewtech for repair.

Of course most of the repair work needed was caused from ppl dorking their units by incorrectly loading S/W. So out came a "cleaner" file, that would allegedly scrub all evidence of a previously loaded "pirate" bin from the receiver, preventing DN from being able to finger scofflaws by using their "jaded" receiver as evidence.

Later on it was incorporated in a three-step bin loading process, to enable the receiver to avail itself in receiving IKS codes.

So do we know if it ever worked? Like I said it wouldn't be difficult. As long as that....and bear with me I think it was the flash memory sector that was being written to....could be written to all that would need be is write over it with binary for about 7 times. As long as the EEPROM wasn't holding information since that needs to be 'electrically' written to for erasure.

[jeldf]

I believe you a would be right.....it is flash. EEPROM requires special equipment, so you cant just upgrade/change/write to it by downloading software from a USB.

[jvvh5897]

A long time ago, code was developed to dump conexant based box's flash and serial EEPROM--code to clear and overwrite via sw would be easy to impliment. If one had the source code and compiler for the code it would be very easy, but between the tools around and a disassembly you could do it with hand written code or compilers that are around. The same should be true of mips based boxes and many of the older ST processors--haven't played with newer ST processor's code yet, but there seems to be a lot in common between boxes using stb7100 for HD.

[thunder bird]

Eprom is nothing more than Ram. Ramdom access memory ,storage

[jeldf]

No. It is Read Only Memory. Totally different. You can write to RAM, not so easily to ROM.

[jazzman]

EPROM= eleltronicaly programmable read only memory. EEPROM is like a book with pages-it stores everything that was ever written to it. At least that's the way it was explained to me when I use to inspect slot machines...

[sodusme]

Yeah RAM is Random Access Memory and ROM is Read Only Memory. RAM can be written to and read and is 'volatile' which means it holds information until power is lost....then its wiped out....but I believe would still hold traces of the software present. ROM is 'read' only and generally cannot be written to.

Now like JVVH says it sounds like EEPROM can be over written if you have the exact source code and compiler? I don't play with plastic and knowing JVVH's knowledge I would have to concur that his response is probably correct.

[jeldf]

unless it's NVRAM (Non-Volatile) which holds its memory........but yes, you and JVVH are correct, you would need the source code.

[sodusme]

unless it's NVRAM (Non-Volatile) which holds its memory........but yes, you and JVVH are correct, you would need the source code.

Yup just like in Cisco routers....;)

(I'm studying for my ICND I portion of the CCNA currently)

[jvvh5897]

Sort of two topics going here. The card EEPROM for older cards could be re-written using the routines in the card that let you do that. ROM is one-time programmable only. EEPROM and flash are to my mind two diff names for the same thing, but EEPROM is older and requires a number of voltages to re-program, newer flash chips don't require any other voltages than the main chip's power to program--if other voltages are required by the internal circuits, then it is generated inside the chip. There is not much diff between serial EEPROM and flash now days--I've seen a number of diff boxes like openbox using an 8-pin serial EEPROM rather than flash--you can get serial EEPROM in 2megbyte sizes pretty cheap and they take up little motherboard space and are much higher access speed.

Good datasheets for cards are the st19 series (N1 and N2 used diff st19 cards). Black-hat papers have good pics of the insides of both N1 and N2 cards with layout showing what is where on the chip die. Think the sle66 (HU card) is in BH papers too.